RE: Disappointing EV article in Sierra Club Mag

["Roger Stockton" <stockton@racalcanada.com>]

Hi Martin,

Yep, we *are* definitely mostly in agreement!

I often find the "miserly" ICEs more enjoyable than those
"other" cars, so I'll reserve judgement on what improvement
(or otherwise) the HEVs we're offered represent until I've had
a chance to get behind the wheel of one or two. (For instance,
I was not at all attracted to the feel of GM's Impact/EV1,
prefering the feel of Axel's Festiva conversion for city driving.
No doubt the EV1 would be wonderful on the highway, however,
for me it's an inferior commuter vehicle, which is what its
range is best suited for.)

An HEV is certainly a superior alternative to a pure-ICE; my
point is that they are not superior (in terms of environmental
impact) to a battery EV in any application which is within the
capabilities of a battery EV.  HEVs with the option of a battery-only
short range mode would be an improvement, however, HEVs tend to carry
such a small pack that this would simply reinforce the public
perception of battery EV range limitations.  And, unless the HEV also
offered the option of recharging the pack from the AC mains, then
after a short, battery-only trip one would still be recharging the
pack from a gasoline/methanol/etc. fueled generator...

The 3x goal of the PNGV group is wonderful, and as you say will take
considerable time and effort to approach.  My point is that along the
way we will be offered interim vehicles, and I would like to know how
the mpg delivered by a practical gasoline/methanol fueled FCEV compares
with that offered by ICE HEVs today.  Both will improve over time;
perhaps the FCEV will overtake other HEVs, perhaps it won't.  If the
motivation for HEVs is reduced environmental impact, then I would rather
select from amongst the available HEV options at any point based on
which one actually performs the best at that time, irrespective of the
technology used.

Cheers,

Roger.

 -----Original Message-----
From:	ev@listproc.sjsu.edu [SMTP:ev@listproc.sjsu.edu]
Sent:	Wednesday, June 30, 1999 12:02 AM
To:	Electric Vehicle List
Cc:	Stockton@racalcanada.com
Subject:	Disappointing EV article in Sierra Club Mag

  Disappointing EV article in Sierra Club Mag

  Roger Stockton comments:

[snip]

"On this basis none of the HEV solutions come close to the
performance of battery EVs for the short-ish range trips which
we are continually told constitute the vast majority of average
driving in the US (and probably elsewhere)."

  As a purist, a short range electric mode should satisfy this argument.
  However, this won't be the design mission configuration produced for
  cost and efficiency reasons. Of course, short trips are not what 1 car
  families 10 miles out of town want to be limited to.

"We're starting to get fuel economy figures for HEVs, such as
60mpg for the Prius and 70mpg for the VV (neither of which is
twice that of the most miserly pure-ICEs);..."

  'the most miserly pure-ICEs' are crummy little boxes that get great
  mileage and make you suffer every inch. Electric power makes the
  minimal car much more comfortable and civilized.

"..it will be particularly interesting to see the corresponding figures
for practical, gasoline-fueled FCEVs..."

  The ratio of 3 X  is a PNGV goal that requires long term development;
  be happy when the 2 X mileage car hits the streets. Any technology.
  East of the Rockies, a hybrid of any description will be much cheaper
  to run than an equivalent EV.
  ______________________________________________________________________