RE: [GBlist] Passive Solar/Thermal Mass Comparison

["Halterman, Jon" <Jon_Halterman@compuware.com>]

Ok,

Thanks for directing my thinking on this.

Enertia (yes, I did mean: http://www.enertia.com) uses wood as their thermal
mass.  Where does this fall in relation to masonry and water?  Does stone
have the same properties as masonry?  Cultured stone?

Thanks,

Jon

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Renewable News Network [mailto:rnn@rnn.com]
> Sent: Monday, March 26, 2001 2:59 PM
> To: Halterman, Jon
> Cc: Ross M. Donald 1-781-453-9668; Greenbuilding (E-mail)
> Subject: RE: [GBlist] Passive Solar/Thermal Mass Comparison
> 
> 
> 
> you getting confused..
> 
> (see below)
> 
> On Mon, 26 Mar 2001, Halterman, Jon wrote:
> 
> > 
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Renewable News Network [mailto:rnn@rnn.com]
> > > Sent: Monday, March 26, 2001 2:28 PM
> > > To: Halterman, Jon
> > > Cc: Ross M. Donald 1-781-453-9668; Greenbuilding (E-mail)
> > > Subject: Re: [GBlist] Passive Solar/Thermal Mass Comparison
> > >
> > > On Mon, 26 Mar 2001, Halterman, Jon wrote:
> > > 
> > > > I was wondering if someone could direct me to a good 
> resource on a
> > > > comparison materials used for thermal mass.  I have heard 
> > > some discussion on
> > > 
> > > concrete has a thermal capacity of .21-.24 (?) 
> Btus/degree F./Pound
> > > water has a thermal capacity of 1.00 Btus/degree F./Pound
> > > 
> > > salt water mixtures have latent heat of melting in the 
> phase changing
> > > ranges, which could be room temperature, but will require 
> more research
> > > and design work on your part - look for a packaged product w/phase
> > > changing material in a pouch or tube, to be installed in a rack or
> > > ceiling tile system.
> > > 
> > > > this but would be interested in learning which 
> materials have the best
> > > > thermal mass properties and how others compare with them.
> > > 
> > > you've basically got water and masonry
> > 
> > I assume stone falls into the same category as masonry?  
> What about cultured
> > stone?  Where is wood in all of this?
> > 
> > > > Also, it seems that the use of insulation is counter 
> productive in
> > > > conjunction with a thermal mass.  One person has suggested 
> > > that the use of
> > > > insulation just increases the time lag associated with a 
> > > thermal mass.  I
> > > > would be interested in any thoughts you have on this.
> > > 
> > > I'd suggest not trying to store your solar heat gain in a 
> high mass
> > > glazed-over exterior wall -- (where is the site?) -- what do 
> > > does it do
> > > you there - you're only going to lose it through the front of the
> > > collector area.  Instead, direct the light or move the heat 
> > > directly to
> > > the point of use or, secondarily, into a storage component, 
> > > designed to
> > > take and hold heat to be drawn down later.
> > 
> > I knew that I would have to explain this better.  The 
> thermal mass used is
> > for a passive cooling system.  The homes designed by Enertia
> > (wwww.enertia.com) 
> 
> do you mean to say:
> 
> http://www.enertia.com  
> 
> > use a solid wood home as thermal mass, 
> 
> to some extent, everything within the "interior" of the 
> house, that is,
> the volume within the thermal envelop will have properties related
> to thermal capacity effecting storage and temperature flux
> 
> > and design the
> > home as a passive heat pump, drawing cool air from the 
> basement through the
> > sunspace.  
> 
> this does not describe what is commonly refered to as a "heat pump."
> 
> > The insulation I was refering to was placed between the basement
> > slab and the earth.  I questioned this because I assumed 
> the whole point of
> > the process was to use the cool air of the earth as a part 
> of the process
> > and not isolate the system from it.  
> 
> The Earth is 55 degrees F. and will absorb and waste, in 
> effect, all the
> temerature you give it.  The slab and basement and any 
> contiguous living
> space will then be 55 degrees and the will have stored nothing.
> 
> > They said it was to add a time lag into
> > the system.  
> 
> Right, they want to keep the heat from escaping by 
> conduction, from the
> living space to the colder Earth, for as long as possible -- 
> heat moves
> to cold -- insulation slows that inevitable entropic process 
> over time, or
> until the sun comes up again, to recharge your space and heat store.
> 
> > I am just looking for further understanding of how insulation
> > can be used in these types of systems.
> > 
> > Thanks again,
> > 
> > Jon 
> > 
> 
> 
> <RNN>
> 

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