Re: [GBlist] Heating backup for masonry stove

[Sacie H Lambertson <dlambert@grasshoppernet.com>]

In response to Corwyn's suggestion that a high thermal mass house is not
suitable for weekend use in a cold climate, I am wondering what the
difference is between the reflective mass of a soapstone stove and that of
a steel/iron stove more commonly used in this country?  The Tivliki is not
the traditional masonry stove used in northern Europe--these latter are
truly massive masonry structures with a special fire chamber built into
them; and while providing wonderful 'soft' heat that radiates over a long
period, this type of traditional masonry stove is very expensive to build,
even if you have the skills required to DIY.  And while I agree that a
traditional masonry stove is not suitable for weekend-only use, the Tivliki
is not in this category.  Correct me if I'm wrong here.  Rather, I suspect
the Tivliki, once fired up, probably offers somewhat more radiant heat than
the normal stove, but that its allure is more in its aesthetics.

Because we found a very good deal, we plan to use an 'Austroflamm' stove,
something similar to the Tivliki I think, in that it has a ceramic surround
that will absorb and retain the stove heat thus allowing it to radiate at a
slower rate than the steel alone would do.  
	
I would still maintain however, that if this weekend place is properly
designed, which is to say, well insulated and tight in both senses, ie
no/little air infiltration and in design-ie not spread out, and if he will
close off the glazing with insulation when he leaves after the weekend, he
could get away without supplemental heat---or with a minimum amount such as
a small propane fired unit earlier suggested.

If he does not mind the money spent, radiant floor heating would be ideally
comfortable.  I think I would design such a structure with one central room
kept at 55/60 degrees with RFH, something in the 400-600 sq ft size range.
Plumbing would be in the well insulated walls of this room and the
bedroom/s and other spaces would be off the central space and left to the
cold.  I bet the RFH would not cost more than $1000 if he put it in
himself, using a direct system and his domestic hot water tank to keep it
going.  A simple propane fired space heater would be less expensive.  Heat
tape on the pipes even less.  But I would try the no supplemental heat and
monitor it first.  
	Fun problem.   Sacie Lambertson





At 08:25 AM 26-01-02 -0500, you wrote:
> On Wednesday, January 23, 2002, at 01:27 PM, robert_barnett@timeinc.com
wrote:
>
>>We're planning to build a 1,300 sq ft weekend home in northern Dutchess
>>county about 2 hours north of  New York city, later this year. We like
>>Tivliki soapstone masonry fireplaces as a heat source, and are planning
>>passive solar feature around a 50-ft-long southern exposure.
>>We're not sure what kind of backup heat source to use, however. Any
>>suggestions? One consideration is that we'll be coming up mostly on
>>weekends, so we'll need something to keep pipes from freezing, and also
>>to get warm on Friday nights until the fireplace heats up.
>>
>
>Nobody seems to have mentioned it, so I will.  It seems like you are
>planning a fairly high thermal mass house.  Although this is great for a
>continuously occupied house, it is not the best solution for a weekend
>retreat.  Over the week all that mass will be losing heat and it will all
>have to be replaced before the house is comfortable.  
>
>Two examples (all numbers are made up to demonstrate a general principle)
>say both lose 100K BTU per day:  A) a light house, thermal mass of 10K BTU/
>degree. B) A heavy house thermal mass of 25k BTU/degree.  House A at 65
>degrees will lose 10 degrees per day, and will take 2 days to reach 45
>degrees (below which you presumably don't want it to go); it will require 4
>hours of 50K BTU woodstove to bring it back to 65.  House B at 65 degrees
>will lose 4 degrees per day and will take 5 days to reach 45 degrees; it
>will require 10 hours to bring it back to 65.  Both houses would require
>the same amount of heating.
>
>
>>Also, the same company that sells Tivliki also sells soapstone kitchen
>>counters. They're black, and need to be oiled about once a month. Does
>>anyone have any experience with this material, as opposed to, say, granite?
>>This is my first post to this list, but I've been subscribing for a year,
>>and find it very useful. 
>>
>
>Soapstone is great, I am considering it for my kitchen.  I have heard you
>only need to oil once per year, either way not much in the way of
>maintenance.  Other colors are also available (Vermont has a beautiful
>green).  It is denser but softer than granite, and not generally as highly
>polished.
>
>Good Luck,
>
>Corwyn
>
>-- 
>Corwyn
>Kermit didn't know the half of it...
>corwyn@midcoast.com 

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