SB: Re: Thanks and Fw.

[Mitch Wapner <paradoxfarm@juno.com>]

As I see it, the problem is that you wanted your questions answered, but
did not
want any opinions or advice or other comments. You failed to clearly
state this, on a list where advice and opinions are routinely offered.
You offended people by then disregarding their advice, and challenging
their opinions! Obviously, SB construction is still experimental, and
opinions are plentiful and (may or) may not have research
to support or prove their validity at this time. The research you are
doing is quite
valuable!! So in the interest of advancing the science of SB, it would
really help if
you reported your "data/results" ON the LIST!! Likewise, the folks who
are asking
"great questions" OFF-LIST should be encouraged to use the list! By the
way, in
the 5 months I've been reading the list I don't think I've seen (til now)
anyone treated
"very badly"!
Mitch

 LOTS of  <SNIP>       Hank wrote:
> The problem is that we were not accepting,
> not that we weren't listening.  Unfortunately, no one ever did us the
> courtesy of responding to our questions so  It wasn't that we weren't
listening but that others weren't bothering to respond.
> Anita was very upset that no one responded to her question about the
> assertion made comparing straw bales to bricks.  It went ignored for
> almost two weeks.  More important than the fact that no one responded
> was the fact that no one noticed and commented on the fact that no one
> responded.  Needless to say, she feels that it was the big names on the
> list who were not listening.

> I strive to maintain polite language and  non confrontational tone 
when
> writing.  I was being insistent with the big boys because they WERE
> providing lots of information but it was NOT topical.  We weren't
trying
> to prove that anyone was wrong but asking the acknowledged experts to
> tell us what the mistakes were in our assumptions.  They seemed to take
> great offense to the fact that we asked them to support their
positions.

 
> That is the cost of a mob mentality.  People with different ideas,
different  >experience, and different visions are beaten down as infidels
by the establishment.
> That last couple of days I asked a very clear, very simple question. 
> The response that I got COMPLETELY ignored by question and instead
> pontificated.  I asked a very simple rebuttal question and was answered
> with angry obscenities.  In the end, all but two of the responses I got
> to my questions came off list.
> 
> At the same time that was going on, John Kingsley was providing a great
> deal of useful and topical information.  He provided links to web pages
> with studies, and a great deal of analysis based on personal
experience.  THAT is > what the list should be about if people are going
to gain the most benefit.

>  I don't think that anyone on the list was offended by anything that I
wrote.  I think >they were offended by the fact that I didn't accept
everything that I was told without >question.  I could see that the list
was degenerating into a mud slinging match and >since we really weren't
getting the information from people like Bill that we
> wanted, we decided to make a polite and graceful exit.
>
> I think we were sent to the list because the two big Canadian 
> builders were being treated very badly, like we were, and they hoped
that we
> could prompt some discussion where they were ignored and attacked.In
fact, they >have suffered quite a bit of off list nastiness as a result
of our three weeks on the >list.  The people who hold themselves up as
 worthy of reverence surely are not.  
> 
> The saddest thing for us is the fact that people were asking great
> questions of us off list  

> Hank.


________________________________________________________________
GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
Join Juno today!  For your FREE software, visit:
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe from the list, send a message to:
   <strawbale-unsubscribe@crest.org>

or for the digest to:
   <strawbale-digest-unsubscribe@crest.org>

Please send any list administration questions to
strawbale-owner@crest.org